TPV Podcast, Episode 49: Paleo Philosophy – Part 2

July 26, 2013 in Categories: , by

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Our forty-ninth show!
Ep. 49: Paleo Philosophy – Part 2

In this episode, Stacy and Sarah tackle part-two of the Paleo Philosophy series, discussing Sally Fallon’s article and the controversial areas within the paleo diet: fat, dairy and sugar.

To listen to part-one of the series, check out episode 48.

Before you read through the show notes, I want to direct you to both my rebuttal of the WAPF newsletter article discussed in this podcast and Stacy’s open letter to WAPFStacy’s letter, posted this morning on, talks about communications with WAPF that transpired after we recorded this episode and sheds some light on possible motivation for the newsletter article that has incited such a backlash from the paleo community.  You can help show your support to the paleo community by sharing both of these posts with your friends and family and commenting on the posts themselves.  It has been three days since I posted my rebuttal, and thus far I have not received any kind of acknowledgement or reply from WAPF.


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The Paleo View (TPV), Episode 49: Paleo Philosophy – Part 2

  • 0:00 – Introduction
  • 1:19 – News & Views
    • Canada has been good for Sarah, but she doesn’t feel like she has been enjoying it much – her relatives are playing with the kids while she works on editing
    • Sarah feels like she is missing out, but she knows that the book has to go to print
    • Sarah’s girls are spending great time with their relatives that they haven’t seen in awhile, so it is good
    • In the midst of editing, Sarah wrote a rebuttal to an article that appeared in Wise Traditions, Weston A. Price Foundation newsletter, where there was a lot of misinformation and criticism on parents who are raising their kids paleo
    • There were several bloggers talking behind the scenes when the newsletter went live because many folks felt personally insulted
    • Diane from Balanced Bites dedicated a podcast in response to this newsletter as well
    • There are so many similarities between the paleo and Weston A. Price community, so it was very disappointing to see the Weston A. Price Foundation strike a divide between the communities and to attack and put many myths forward
    • It is overall uncool to be divisive like that, it doesn’t help the community or foster growth at all
    • When you are a guiding voice within a community you have a responsibility to be a mature voice, to do your research fully and to present factual information
    • Every leader in the paleo community has there own way that they put forth information on how to create a healthy, sustainable lifestyle, and at the core of all these messages is ‘figure out what works for you – strike your own balance’
    • Stacy points out that through education her kid’s are able to define what their own splurges are and how to develop their personal balance so they are able to enjoy life in a way that still supports their health
    • If the argument is that paleo kids are so deprived, what part of a Weston A. Price Foundation diet isn’t also depriving these children – if you have to sprout your grains, eat only raw dairy, where are you finding that in schools?
    • For Stacy the article was infuriating and upsetting because an article like this doesn’t help anyone, it only stimulates misconceptions
    • Sarah notes that since there are so many similarities between Weston A. Price and paleo, you think that we could combine our resources to educate instead of trying to show some level of superiority – you could reach so many more people if we were to work together with a focus on nutrient density
    • The Weston A. Price Foundation seems to be determined to separate out from the paleo movement, and it isn’t clear why any organization would want to go against something that is supporting the same key principles
    • Sarah finds it infuriating that her mission to raise her children in a healthy way, where they don’t feel like they are different or missing out on something, makes her a bad parent – being told that Sarah is in the wrong for feeding her daughter’s in a way that supports their health was like a punch in the stomach
    • Stacy points out that this is not the first time that the paleo community has experienced this attitude from the Weston A. Price Foundation, however, this has been the most blatant attack that they have ever distributed
    • While Amy Kubal was promised for this week’s show, we need to wait for the Ancestral Health Symposium to come to a wrap and will feature Amy at that time
    • This week, Sarah and Stacy will be moving right into part-two of the Paleo Philosophy discussion, as last week’s show received such a great response
  • 24:51 – Paleo Philosophy Part-2
    • If you haven’t listened to episode 48 yet, go back and listen to that show to help set the stage for where the discussion is at in this show
    • Fat
      • One of the Weston A. Price’s criticism was that we don’t eat fat, we only eat lean meats and low omega-6 plant fats, like coconut oil or olive oil
      • Stacy wrote a book about lard, so Stacy’s feelings towards fat are pretty clear
      • Even for someone without a gallbladder, like Stacy’s situation, consuming monounsaturated fats is easier on the body than if it was a polyunsaturated fat – Stacy finds it easier to digest the fats that are saturated and monounsaturated because her body doesn’t have to work as hard to break them down
      • Sarah provided a scientific overview on the difference between the three kinds of fats and how they impact your body
      • Stacy went from being a coconut oil, broccoli and chicken paleo person to a lard/tallow paleo person, which is when she got into nutrient density because she learned that she wasn’t properly absorbing food
      • When Diana Rodgers was on the show Stacy learned a ton about how she should be supplementing and eating to absorb nutrients
      • Not only is the paleo community interested in eating the fats of healthy animals, the paleo community encourages people to find what works for them to make them feel their best
      • Sarah feels that there are more folks who do low-carb and high-fat, as opposed to a low-fat approach
      • Sarah notes that there is still so much misinformation about the impact of fat on our health – people are still really scared of eating fat
      • When Sarah was doing the research for The Paleo Approach, she found that the most important micronutrients that people are deficient in that are strongly linked to autoimmune diseases are fat-soluble vitamins, and that comes from us not eating enough fat and from eating the wrong kinds of fats
      • If anyone listening to The Paleo View is afraid to eat fat, don’t be – go eat some lard
    • (39:20) Dairy
      • On the autoimmune show with Mickey Stacy mentioned that she had reincorporated dairy fat successfully, which is really exciting since Stacy has had an issue with dairy her entire life
      • By healing her body through the autoimmune protocol and a nutrient dense approach to eating, Stacy has been able to successfully introduce dairy into her diet
      • While Stacy still believes that it is somewhat unnatural to eat the breastmilk of other animals, she has also read Practical Paleo and researched Weston A Price and knows how nutrient dense grass-fed dairy is, and if Stacy is able to tolerate dairy it can be a nutrient dense food for her
      • When Stacy started incorporating grass-fed butter and grass-fed heavy cream she saw improvements in her skin and joints and other things that use to experience negative effects from dairy
      • For Stacy her paleo philosophy on dairy has evolved a great deal since she started paleo, but she doesn’t think her family will ever be consuming high quantities of dairy since her kids are extremely sensitive to it
      • The Paleo Parents family walks a fine line to enjoy high-quality dairy products because it is a nutrient dense food, but they will not incorporate it at the sacrifice and health of their family
      • Stacy is at a new phase in her paleo journey when it comes to dairy and will continue to enjoy it in moderation since her body is tolerating it
      • Sarah notes that there is some research that suggests there are benefits to being cautious with dairy protein, however, dairy fat from grass-fed animals is a healthful fat that has an overwhelming nutrient value
      • Raw, whole milk from grass-fed cows has some great stuff in it, and science doesn’t stand firm on one side versus the other
      • This is why you see variation in how people approach this, people who identify as primal or lacto-paleo incorporate dairy into their lives in a way that works for them
      • Some people do really well with dairy, some people do really well without dairy – it is far more important to find what is working for you as an individual
      • As a paleo community we sometimes get really focused on the no-rules that we forget that some of these foods are potentially nutrient dense foods depending on your tolerances
      • As the paleo diet evolves and we learn more about how food effects our body, genes, proteins our body makes, etc. we are going to be able to narrow down what foods are beneficial and if that applies to some people, all people, etc.
      • Again, there is no right answer for the role that dairy plays in our diet, it is about finding what works for you
      • Beginning your paleo journey dairy free can be beneficial so you can do some elimination dieting to see if you tolerate it upon reintroduction
    • (52:30) Fruit & Sugar
      • For Stacy she avoids refined sugar, her kids have incredibly negative reactions to it
      • The Paleo Parents still enjoy treats, as them being defined just as that, treats
      • No matter what sugar you are talking about, Stacy would never define it as “paleo”
      • For blogging purposes treats are labeled as “paleo” so that folks can easily Google alternatives to refined sugar treats
      • Sarah’s family doesn’t eat much of the treats she prepares for recipe development, they either give them away or freeze them – they find a way to practice treating treats as just that, and practicing control and moderation
      • People get very passionate that we should eat exactly as a caveman ate, but that isn’t possible in today’s world – food simply isn’t the same as it was then
      • Sarah doesn’t think it is a healthy approach to food, to restrict foods that are very healthful foods just because they look like something unhealthy
      • To Stacy when we start to say no to things in absolute terms that are made with wholesome ingredients, we are getting into the topic of orthorexia, disordered eating, etc. – there is nothing wrong with eating coconut flour egg yolk crepes or something with a base of cauliflower with meat and vegetables on top
      • Define your paleo how you want to define your paleo, but don’t judge somebody else for what they chose to do, don’t tell them what they should or shouldn’t do
      • We will discuss sugar in greater detail in part-three, but the content will be broken up my other podcast topics
      • If you have specific topics that you would like us to cover in this series please send topics to the podcast question box
      • And if you are enjoying the show, please don’t forget to leave a review on iTunes!
  • 1:06:38 – Outro

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Thanks so much for so many great shows and I am loving the paleo philosophy episodes please keep them coming! :). I share your podcast with all my mom friends and anyone with questions about the paleo lifestyle. I love all of the science you share! Thank you again! All the best, Elissa

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